midi and guitars

by **cheif02** on Sun Jun 03, 2007 1:19 pm

I'm looking for the best tool to record midi from a stringed insterment. Has anyone here had experience with this? I would prefer to let the musician use their own insterment. What are your thoughts?
Thanks - Loren

by **Nick_godin** on Mon Jun 04, 2007 2:08 pm

What are you looking to get out of this. Is it because you want control over your sound choice in the mixing process?

Personally I wouldn't go for this method. Just record the raw instruments. Use effects to get different tones and sounds.

Here are some midi pickups.

by **Rw457** on Wed Jun 06, 2007 9:04 am

What if he wanted to apply these midi files from a guitar to keyboard sounds-is it possible? I have wondered about this myself as I am new to midi processes. I know that there are midi controllers shaped like guitars but can you take a signal from an ordinary guitar and generate a midi file from this? I have heard that the only stupid question is one that you don't ask so here's mine

by **Big Tim** on Wed Jun 06, 2007 9:41 am

As Nick pointed out, there are MIDI pickups you can attach to guitars which will generate MIDI notes from the strings as you play it, the problem is that they require a different playing style which is not very "guitar" oriented. For example, you can't thrash and strum wildly away on a guitar and expect it to sound like a flugel horn, just because you recorded the MIDI and patched it through a horn setting. You need to be very precise in your playing and actually attempt to recreate the way a horn is played. Chords are out of the question (unless you're crazy and like abusing the technology..!) with single-note instruments (brass, woodwind for eg). I knew a guy who put a Roland MIDI pickup on his Line 6 Variax and hooked it inot a synth. It was a lot of fun, but wildly inaccurate and the slightest hint of poor playing or string bending just made it sound terrible. Terrible synth sounds too.

Although the technology is improving a lot, it's often far easier (and a LOT more fun) to actually chart it out and stick a mic on the real thing. It'll sound realistic, for a start!

by **mcramer** on Wed Jun 06, 2007 9:48 am

If you wanna hear it in action watch Bill Bailey - Part Troll. He uses MIDI pickups to create the backing strings etc. in his "love song". VERY funny

http://youtube.com/watch?v=bt_DiFPcn3w& ... ed&search=

by **Tweak** on Thu Jun 07, 2007 2:48 am

Great video!

I was listening to some of my older tracks that used MIDI guitar. (Yamaha G10) I was pissed that I chose to use it, as in retrospect it really sticks out as a plastic sounding guitar. Yeah, I tried strumming with bar chords, leads, even finger picking! Oddly, it was the finger picking that came out OK (after a massive midi clean up job) and the strumming that was utterly bad.

Sigh. That was a long time ago. Now we have the Roland VG99 about to hit. Due in July. Wondering if anyone has had a chance to play one.

http://www.zzounds.com/a--3745/item--ROLVG99

by **cheif02** on Sun Jun 10, 2007 2:04 pm

You guys have given me more insight on this subject than my previous month of research provided.
My thoughts were to have the option on mix that if the customer wanted to have, for example, a fatter rythm, I could just copy midi to a key or native track to beef it up.
One thing I was unsure of was playing style, ie note bending, and the midi translation to a different voice. Being a keyboard player myself, I am now reminded of having to adjust my own playing style to match the voice I am using. Such as recording a piano track and then changing the voice to tuba. It may have some comedy value but it sure won't be realistic.
I would still love to find a way to bring this option to my customer. It seems to be limited now, but technology may suprize us in the future.

by **Big Tim** on Mon Jun 11, 2007 5:34 am

Yeah, the piano/tuba thing you describe is exactly the same as with a guitar MIDI part. The thing that makes it even harder is that a guitar is far less compatible with the "play it so it sounds like a tuba" principle than a keyboard is. It's totally counter-intuitive to a guitarist (but hey, what isn't?!) and the way a guitar is normally played. I think handing a regular guitarist a guitar fitted with a MIDI pickup & a tuba (or any) patch and asking them to play a brass part would be a recipe for disaster. It takes a lot of practice and it's not something you can just do.

by **nanashiwanderer** on Mon Jun 11, 2007 5:36 am

I actually am curious... about this... I can see a lot of creative uses for a midi guitar, for wierd textures and stuff. Of course I'd be in the abuse technology category.

by **mcramer** on Mon Jun 11, 2007 5:40 am

mcramer wrote:If you wanna hear it in action watch Bill Bailey - Part Troll. He uses MIDI pickups to create the backing strings etc. in his "love song". VERY funny

http://youtube.com/watch?v=bt_DiFPcn3w& ... ed&search=

Watch this. It's a really good use of having both MIDI and audio from guitars at the same time. In a live setting anyway. In a studio setting it probably wouldn't be as useful/

by **yuro_inyourface** on Sat Jun 16, 2007 10:12 am

i tried with a Roland Gr-20 and a Gk Pick up. Nice for pads sounds, strange solo instruments.. Forget about the hard rocker chords, bends, etc...

for recording? Nice for pads sounds, strange solo instruments.. Forget about the hard rocker chords, bends, etc...

It´s more for live performances, to add strange souns around your playing (if you dont have a keyborad player!) or if you are a one man band.

the mainthing is: the pickups and module can´t trnaslate all the details to the Midi world. period.

by **nanashiwanderer** on Sat Jun 16, 2007 2:42 pm

>Watch this. It's a really good use of having both MIDI and audio from guitars at the same time. In a live setting anyway. In a studio setting it probably wouldn't be as useful/
_________________

I did

by **Nick_godin** on Sat Jun 16, 2007 2:58 pm

Nanashi, was there supposed to be a link in your post, or were you refering the link in the thread?

by **nanashiwanderer** on Sat Jun 16, 2007 3:02 pm

> This symbol is commonly used while quoting people in bbs that don't have quote functions. However I was just being lazy.

by **jar4ever** on Sat Jun 16, 2007 3:02 pm

nanashiwanderer wrote:I actually am curious... about this... I can see a lot of creative uses for a midi guitar, for wierd textures and stuff. Of course I'd be in the abuse technology category.

My thoughts exactly. Actually, the Gibson LP with the digital pickups that has a discrete output for each string sounds more interesting, but that thing is like $5k.

by **Nick_godin** on Sat Jun 16, 2007 3:04 pm

Gotcha. Does anyone know of any other videos that experiment with MIDI pickups?
video

Edit : Found one video that demonstrates the use of the Roland GR-09. Would be fun to try out!

by **cheif02** on Sat Jun 16, 2007 4:47 pm

Thanks for sharing the videos. Seeing and hearing made me realize I need more education. Most of the effects are, in the computer world, old technologies. I'm behind the learning curve even on the old stuff!!
Had the chance to watch a band recently. Little bar in South Dakota. This 3 piece band sounded like a 12 piece. Thanks to automation, Bass Drums and Guitar can do Motown live. You just can't see the horn section.
20 yrs ago a band would have to fork out a large payroll to make the sound these 3 guys (and probably 5k worth of electronics) demonstrated out here in the sticks.
If a traveling band can master technologies, this should be a cake walk for us in the studio mindset. What do you think?

midi and guitars

midi and guitars

Great response!

Great info

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