Sonar 3 is here

by **Xeeban** on Wed Oct 01, 2003 4:25 pm

FedEx just dropped off Sonar 3! So if you've pre-ordered, it should be arriving anytime now.

I had it shipped to work... now I have to wait to get home to give it a whirl.

by **nmodi** on Wed Oct 01, 2003 4:55 pm

Doesn't SOnar 3 ship with VSampler? That's kinda odd because at vsampler3.com it hasn't yet been released!

by **owel** on Wed Oct 01, 2003 4:55 pm

Oh man... sweeet... Give us a review, okay?

by **AWannaBe** on Wed Oct 01, 2003 5:19 pm

I believe only the Producer Edition has the VSampler... and since it's an add in to the Sonar product it could still be shipping... just because it dosn't show on their website as a full product release dosn't mean that it's not done or shipping OEM... just that the Retail Full Version is unavailable...

by **dfroom** on Wed Oct 01, 2003 9:34 pm

Cool! Let us know how you like it! I was really hoping that mine would be here to day but like the song goes pins and needles,

by **cornieleous** on Wed Oct 01, 2003 10:59 pm

I installed Cakewalk Sonar 3 today. I have just finished playing around with it for a few hours. They sure have
done a nice job on this version. They have answered many of the users' wishes including mine..... Here comes my mini review.......
I think some of you other Cakewalk fans might be interested in the following new features:

1.) Color customization! - you can get this version to look quite sexy if you work at it. Color coding for different track types(midi ,audio, dxi, bus) if you want it.

2.) The Track Inspector- gives you a better view of the selected track. (It is basically a single strip off the console view, without having to open that view.)

3.) New console view - its actually almost pretty. Still, Cakewalk has retained some elements of its simple 'Cakewalkish' look and feel, which I enjoy.

4.) Improved midi routing - now you can layer different sound modules and synths to the same midi track to make crazy thick sounds without having to resort to audio to do it. Also one controller keyboard can be split to control many synths, or many controller keyboards can be made to control one synth, or one keyboard to one synth and another keyboard to another...etc.

5.) Dynamic busses - busses can be added or removed without restarting the software. ALSO! Finally mutable busses. Thats right ! You now can mute busses.

6.) Per track input monitoring - Sonar now has selectable input monitoring on every track type including busses. This is going to be super useful!

7.) Smart Routing - a feature exists that supposedly will not allow you to select Ins/Outs where a feedback loop occurs (havent tried to defeat this feature yet but I think it works.)

8.) Confidence recording - recording draws on your screen in real time.

9.) Arm/Mute/Solo Highlight- the tracks that are armed for recording have a red tint in the track pane while muted tracks get slightly dimmer, and soloed tracks make all other tracks dim except the soloed.

10.) Faster Boot - boots faster than did version 2 on my machine- probably on yours too.

As far as my opinion, I do not wish to make too much in the way of comparisons to other sequencers. We all like what we like. In general however, many of these upgrades to Sonar were overdue. Other sequencers had already employed many of these features, and prettier graphics. I have always liked how my work flows in Cakewalk best, and am certainly happy with the new version.
I personally think Cakewalk has always employed the best midi editing capabilities and they seem to have the edge if you are into loops, and with all these new features I think Cakewalk fans finally have what we were yearning for. Obviously I can dream up even more improvements, but I was stunned when I saw that literally almost every complaint I have ever had with Sonar was answered by the added functionality of version 3. Anyway, hope my mini review was worthy to you, and now it is time for me to start thinking up new complaints that I expect to be answered in Sonar 4

hope this is useful ....

by **owel** on Thu Oct 02, 2003 12:20 am

>4.) Improved midi routing - now you can layer different sound modules and synths to the same midi track to make crazy thick sounds without having to resort to audio to do it. Also one controller keyboard can be split to control many synths, or many controller keyboards can be made to control one synth, or one keyboard to one synth and another keyboard to another...etc.

If this works as promised, maybe I won't even need to buy a hardware midi router. This is even more powerful. Sweeettt!

>8.) Confidence recording - recording draws on your screen in real time.

I will like this one!

Thanks for the review!

by **Tweak** on Thu Oct 02, 2003 12:25 am

>8.) Confidence recording - recording draws on your screen in real time.

AT LAST!

Many thanks cornieleous!

by **Xeeban** on Thu Oct 02, 2003 1:30 am

I just now installed and have played with it a bit. Here are my impressions/discoveries so far (I'll try to skip things already covered):

On initial install, Sonar 3 wants to install the latest DirectX (I think it was 9.0b). That requires a reboot after it installs. After that, the install is very quick.

1) First impressions. Yes, it does load incredibly fast. You double click, and its up in a few seconds on my machine. Nice. The software looks much better!

Here is a screenshot:
http://www.xeeban.com/sonar3/images/sonar-startup.jpg

2) Yes, its shipping with VSampler 3... I just registered it and the activation key was something like 400 characters long (no joke!). Thank heavens for cut and paste =) After registering and entering the key, it seems to be a fully functional VSampler 3. There are two CDs worth of samples for the VSampler included,

Another screenshot:
http://www.xeeban.com/sonar3/images/vsampler.jpg

3) Midi FX - Lite versions of Rhythm'N' Chords and Slicy Drummer are included which is nice. NTONYX - Style Enhancer Micro 2.0 is also on the install disk with some sample data.

4) Midi Groove Clips. These are like the audio groove clips, but are comprised of MIDI data. This is very sweet. You can insert a midi groove clip and roll it out just like audio groove clips. Saves a lot of cut and paste.

5) Audio - As mentioned above, you can create buses as you need them and assign tracks. You can send buses to another bus, or to the main out. Not only can you mute buses, you can solo them too. And for the last leg of the audio trip, each hardware output has its own volume and panning.

6) Bouncing - When you mix down, you have the choice of sending each bus to its own submix, each hardware out to its own submix, or all to a single track.

Overall, I am very impressed and happy with it. Now I am off to do some mixing and put it through some tests.

by **mark_knutson** on Sat Oct 04, 2003 9:59 am

I am very pleased with S3. Since cakewalk does not do intermediate releases I had thought they were letting this product languish.

I think they fixed the few things that were weaknesses but left most of the good stuff alone so it truly qualifies for the word 'upgrade'.

I had S2 and upgraded to studio for $99. That's a lot of bang for the buck!

by **cornieleous** on Mon Oct 06, 2003 2:34 pm

My past review mentioned nothing negative with sonar 3. I have discovered something that I feel is a horrible move by the designers:

Cakewalk Sonar 3 from everything I can tell has removed design mode for studioware panels. You can still use studioware panels, but you cannot make your own. I was about two thirds of the way done making extensive panels for a Waldorf Micro Q, and a Proteus 2500. Now I will have to re-install Sonar 2 just to finish building them. I fear they may totally remove studioware panels in future versions of Sonar.

For those that do not know - studioware panels allow you to make your own custom GUI to control any or all of the features of your synths. Basically if you are willing to learn about System Exclusive messages, and type a little in hex, then you can make a custom patch editor that looks and acts exactly how you want it too. You will not exactly have a librarian, but can edit and save patches in an environment that looks and feels how you designed it too.

If any one else is going to miss studioware panels, then please voice your opinion to Cakewalk, as I did. Maybe if a few people say something, they will reinstate the technology into the software. Worth a shot I say.

Thanks.

by **Snow** on Fri Oct 10, 2003 1:35 am

just got sonar 3 pro up and running...
and quite simply, it's awesome
i made a little graphic of some of the features on a basic layout (and the VSampler) (about which xeeban was not kidding! 400 char reg key, hope your ctrl and c keys aren't broken :p)

EDIT: sorry had to pull this, pushing server disk quota

(make sure IE isn't resizing your images, go to tools-internet options-advanced-multimedia-disable automatic image resizing)

if you want any other images let me know...

anyway,
cool stuff/first impressions that weren't covered already:
1) meter peak value (in dB) reads out right on the track view in real time on all tracks and buses (image shows where value would be if a real project were playing)

2) select properties: toggle whether or not envelopes are selected along with clips in the track view or not (one of my personal favorites and resolved gripes with s2)

3) midi track editing: select which midi tracks are to be edited/shown/heard in the piano roll without having to reselect from track view or go into track selector box

space savers:
4) vertical or horizontal meters

5) console and track inspector strips can be narrowed

layout:
6) color coded markers for now time/loop/marker, and other items correspond to color coded buttons in respective toolbars

7) good window memory, remembers where you like different views, and remembers to maximize to full desktop (a miracle to any dual monitor users who have battled s2 to keep the app fully maximized on startup)

8: sonar1/2/2xl users will find they're instantly right at home in the new environment, improvements/modifications don't upset the framiliar sonar feel at all

9) cosmetics: not only is s3p color customizable like they other posts have said, but it comes with many (nearly 50) preset color schemes, a lot of them are pretty silly, but if you were one of the users who had problems with s2's "limited" appearance you should be able to do some damage here

negative(which is really a positive):
10) one feature that annoyed me at first was a 'return to now marker on stop' deal...every time you click to a now time, then hit play, when you stop it automatically returns to the last now time, it stopped bothering me as soon as a turned it off

but seriously, this could be a cool feature when you actually want it (example, for recording a section in multiple (other perfectionists might identify with "100's") of takes, just record, it'll snap back, if you don't want that take, hit ctrl-z and you're already lined up for your next take...(just wish it was button toggled instead of buried in the menu system)

other notes:
transition from sonar 2 was smooth, boots fast, confidence recording is very cool, greatly improved routing capabilities...

anyway, i'm very pleased so far...i'll try to put together a more focused, complete review once i get a chance to really dive into it...but don't expect me to give you any reasons not to buy/upgrade to this software,
many thanks to cakewalk on this one :wink:

be good,
-snow :shock:

by **U2bonoman** on Sat Oct 11, 2003 7:55 am

I, as a newbie, would like to know how the audio is...How is it compared to say, Cubase SX? Much thanks to the beholder of this answer...

by **Snow** on Sat Oct 11, 2003 5:58 pm

the audio is going to be as true as the sound you get it into your computer, the sequencer is just looking at numbers, your sound quality is going to come down to your digital audio converters (sound card), cable runs (shorter/balanced is better, watch for power cables), microphones (acoustics of room, ect.), and instruments (including effects boxes). as for choosing a sequencer, go with the one with the best combination of feel/power for what you want to do...i've never spent much time with Cubase so i couldn't tell you, never had the need to consider it cause i'm more than happy with sonar
let me know if i totally missed the point of your question

-snow

by **U2bonoman** on Sat Oct 11, 2003 8:35 pm

Hey thanks - You didn't miss my point at all. So if audio is really only affected by what your running through, such as your interface, does that mean that sequencers can end up costing more just because of features, and not actual audio quality? So could I just run through a nice soundcard and use Cakewalk Home Studio XL and get really good results? Upgrading to Sonar 3 would just get me more features? Hope these aren't stupid questions - Just wanna make sure I understand this..

by **doktorziplok** on Sat Oct 11, 2003 9:54 pm

So if audio is really only affected by what your running through, such as your interface, does that mean that sequencers can end up costing more just because of features, and not actual audio quality?

for the most part this is true. i say "most part" because you'll find people claim to hear differences. i feel that any audible difference is subliminally created by the person, they want one to sound better so they tell themselves it does. just download the demos for the sequencers you're interested in, that'll be enough to tell you about how they sound on their own.

as far as cost being in relation to features, i don't quite agree. i believe the cakewalk line (especially the xl versions) comes in at the top of the heap, pound for pound. that being said, i use cubase sx because i feel it has the best feature set for the platform (pc). best being subjective. when i made the switch from sonar i was drawn to [sx's] the interface, surround capabilities, available vst/vsti's, and other features.

by **Tweak** on Sun Oct 12, 2003 4:14 am

In this day and age everyone has great audio quality who learns how to use the software and has a decent soundcard and clean signal path. The plugins in each sequencer sound different. I think Logic's are better than SX or sonars. But without effects you really have to split some hairs to hear differences. Audio quality comes from mics, preamps, and other stuff you put in the recording chain--and most important, your ability to tweak and massage these tracks in a sequencer.

by **BucKWilD** on Sun Oct 12, 2003 8:56 am

Hello. My thoughts are this. A side from plungin effects that cakewalk or steinberg supply with there products, I really like to use the product for what it's truely intended to be used as. An audio and midi recorder. It's nice that companies give you extra's such as mixing or mastering plugins but I prefer to deal with companies like ex. waves etc. in which mixing and mastering is specifically there bread and butter it's what they do. Mind you a little or a lot more doe! but you get what you pay for. Im not knocking on cake or steinberg as there included plugins arn't terrible or any thing. There's just a point after a while as you progress with your work and your ears tend to be alot more open to what your hearing that it becomes clear that you want the best!. That's where I'm at right now. For the longest time I didn't like the thought of putting hours into a song with effects that wern't just cutting it and then have to redo the song knowing that I'd be investing in plugins that would surely out perform the ones I'm using. But again it comes down to saving $$$ to get what you have been drooling about. Does any one feel the same, or have any idea what I'm on about?.

by **U2bonoman** on Sun Oct 12, 2003 9:16 am

Thanks for setting it straight for me!

by **BucKWilD** on Sun Oct 12, 2003 8:25 pm

U2bonoman I hope that helped a little if not alot. Start off with what ever you prefer get comfortable with perhaps using what ever plugins are supplied. Get to know what they are and how to use them and then go from there. Just about everything out there today is fairly decent especially recording in the digital domain. Have fun.

by **Tweak** on Mon Oct 13, 2003 1:42 am

Does any one feel the same, or have any idea what I'm on about?.

Quality plugins do greatly enhance any sequencer. I use the waves stuff myself and they certainly are a much stronger determinant of sound quality than the sequencer itself is.

by **U2bonoman** on Tue Oct 14, 2003 9:23 am

Here is a question....The system requirements for Sonar 3 state that you have to have at least 1024 X 768 resolution, 16-bit color. I am not sure if I have that or not, though I guess I do because my desktop is almost brand new....Why do you have to have that? Is it really affected by what your picture looks like? Would it not install if I didn't have that, though I 'think' I do? Thanks....

by **dfroom** on Tue Oct 14, 2003 10:20 am

Right click on your screen and bring up the display properties. Look under settings and you will find out what your are currently at. Adjust to what Sonar needs if you are not there and hit apply. If every thing works you will be fine.

by **Snow** on Tue Oct 14, 2003 12:45 pm

resolution is how much usable space you have, higher resolution means objects are smaller and more precice, so you can fit more on the screen (1280 x 960 is a good standard shaped res)...1024/768 is likely a suggested resolution by cakewalk, im sure it would run at any resolution, but with lower resolutions you might not see everything (values/buttons might project off the screen) or you would just have an unreasonably small space to work with.
as for color, i'm pretty certain you're at 16 or more, even if you weren't, it would still work properly, it would just look odd.
pretty much any computer/video card made after '98 or so isn't going to have a problem with any of this so don't worry about it
be good,
-snow :shock:

by **U2bonoman** on Tue Oct 14, 2003 3:51 pm

Thanks!!

Sonar 3 is here

Sonar 3 is here

Sonar 3 mini Review

Update on Sonar 3

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